Jeanie: I answer affirmative to all Russ's questions but he still doesn't "judge" me to be Christian. I think he's a little big for his britches. Sometimes I wonder if he isn't thinking he is starting his own church. He does have some followers.

Russ: It has nothing to do with me judging you to be a Christian.

I know more about Mormon doctrine than 98% of Mormons do. I have met many Mormon missionaries who know even less (astounding, but they will still win followers not versed in the Bible).

Jeanie: Bull hockey. How about focusing on the fact that these young men in their prime hormonal state take out 2 years of their lives completely devoting themselves (no dating, music, tv) to scripture study and PAY FOR THEIR OWN MISSIONS.... I've known young men who put off promising athletic careers or even just their schooling. My son-in-law is a returned missionary going to school to become a Dr. If he hadn't spent those 2 years on a mission, he could've been in med school by now. He spent about $9000 of his own or families money to go out and teach the gospel. Our Bishops don't get paid. They put in many hours, yet still work full time jobs and have families to take care of. My present Bishop is only in his early 30s and has 5 little kids. Do you think they do this for their health???? No, they don't know everything there is to know....and many times they have been sheltered and sometimes just go cause they are supposed to. The majority of the time, though, they come back with great discipline from it, and a strong testimony that they might not have had before. Yet they get doors slammed in their faces. Some have been threatened. Hmmm. What would make them do that????

Yet all you focus on is that they might not know the Bible as well as they should. In my case, by the time I was 14 I had read and studied it which is why I had so many unanswered questions....

Russ: Mormonism is based on Scottish Rite Freemasonry. It's that simple.

Jeanie: You don't know what you are talking about and won't listen to the truth on that....

Russ: When you examine the symbolism of the temple ceremonies, they confess Jesus to be the brother of Christ.

Jeanie: BULL. I've been through the temple many times and that is a lie!

Russ: You also wear the apron of the priesthood of lucifer during the ceremony. The ceremonies are secret to the public, for obvious reasons.

Jeanie: Yah - because people like you twist and mock what goes on in there. You are listening to the wrong sources here...and dark ones at that. Everything is symbolic of the Priesthood and the apron is of the leaves that covered Adam and Eve's nakedness.

Russ: You wear underwear with symbolism from religions referred to (in the Bible) as being from the Babylonian mystery religions "for your protection".

Jeanie: That is your twisted interpretation.

Russ: Mormon temples are full of masonic symbolism. I've visited them myself many times. I've attended conference, personally see an "apostle", read significant parts (or all) of ALL of the main mormon doctrinal books. I've studied both positions (pro and con) related to mormon historical archeology. This is more than most Mormons do.

Jeanie: None of this qualifies you to know what you are talking about cause you don't understand any of it. Just like with evolution, knowledge is not wisdom. The symbolism is all about the Priesthood. Has it occurred to you that the Masons really DID try to protect those priesthood ordinances from the original church through the ages? Joseph Smith said that they had a form of PH but it was apostate. The symbols are about the Melchizidek and Aaronic Priesthoods which are QUITE Biblical. I believe the symbolism on the Nauvoo temple had to do with the 3 degrees of glory. The Anchorage, AK temple had those, too. SO?????

Russ: Then there is the Book of Abraham. The contradictions with Biblical scripture, and on and on.

Jeanie: You want to name them?

Russ: Most mormons are very nice people. Some of them look to the church for fellowship or business contacts. Unfortunately, they are not interested in the symbology or the truth behind the organization. Of couse, this is also true for masons. They are not interested in the lucifarian oaths they take. They are usually only interested in the business advantages they gain.

Jeanie: That is because their is no big evil mystery to the symbolism. And your other statements are certainly not the case with me or any other member I know. I suppose you've met the several million members in the church? They don't let us use rosters to promote business.

Russ: God expects us to seek Him. He also expects us to be strong, faithful, intellectual, logical, loving, truthful, and to be considerate enough of others to tell them the truth.

Jeanie: Which is what I'm doing....cause I love you man! Don't you feel loved?

Russ: I don't mean to hurt anyone's feelings, but sometimes there is something that needs to be said that is so important, that it does not matter if it hurts someone's feelings.

Jeanie: I totally agree. Which is why I'm trying to help you.

Russ: If you were standing on railroad tracks with headphones on and a train was approaching from behind you, would you view me as a moral person if I let you get run over because I didn't want to scare you with the truth that a train was coming. This is the same type of situation.

Jeanie: Not on this. You offer lots and lots of things for us to be scared of, though.

Russ: The truth about eternal life, death, hell, love, and all of the warnings, teachings, admonitions and prophecies in the Bible about life are so important, that it's vital that I love you enough and that I have enough character to let you know if you're standing on the rail road tracks.

Jeanie: Hmmm. What if I believe that about you?

Russ: The best place for any mormon to start studying truth is to learn about all the places that mormon doctrine contradicts the Bible. You then have to decide which doctrine is correct. Yes, this is a good place to start.

Jeanie: That is where you are wrong, because it simply proves to CLARIFY the Bible. However, go ahead and state what you think....So YOU know the correct interpretation???

Russ: I studied with mormon missionaries many times, and when they left, I felt the deep depression and spiritual oppression that many mormons experience. Yes, spiritual oppression often manifests itself as negative emotions. Some mormons having experienced these same emotions have committed suicide.

Jeanie: That is because you were not really listening to them. Do you think satan wants you to believe in the truth? Has it ever ocurred to you that SATAN was oppressing you? Don't you think I got hit with all the anti-Mormon garbage out there?

Russ: The same is true of some of those who get involved in witchcraft or magic. I personally know someone who attempted suicide after being involved in magic. It is not uncommon, and is usually associated with deep feelings of worthlessness and/or depression.

Jeanie: While LDS members are no less vulnerable to depression than anyone else....I guarantee that those who truly believe and live their religion are the happiest people in the world. But life is not without opposition and we are here to experience trials.

Russ: But God has not given us a spirit of fear, but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.

I care about your salvation.

I feel sorry for you for I know how difficult it is to study things that threaten the comfort zone of your world view, yet it is important to do if you are concerned about knowing who God really is; And this is important indeed.

Jeanie: You know what Russ? You want to know the truth? I have had a rough year with members of the church to include my LDS sister in law. Sometimes I wish I didn't know it was true.... Because it is harder to live. Those garments you are blaspheming are to remind of us covenants for purity and modesty. I have not had an easy year marriage wise. Life is not easy. I have felt much like Job this past year. BUT I CANNOT DENY WHAT I KNOW TO BE TRUE. We are on opposite ends of that spectrum. You are dead wrong my friend.... Some day you will find that out.

Do you want to know the truth? I get the impression that you are emotionally stunted.... You tell everyone else what their problems are, but perhaps you need to take a look into your own heart and psyche.

Russ: I'm sure you're a very well meaning person with good intentions, but don't neglect to study, as God told us to do, because He said the deception of the time near the end of the age (the time we are in right now) will be strong.

Jeanie: Yes, I'm witnessing that right now...

Russ: Don't be deceived. Just study and ask the God of the Bible for guidance. Be strong and persist. He is merciful and patient. We must be as well.

Jeanie: Russ, don't you get it?? I HAVE. And I actually gave it a fair shake. I did this alone. I have been the only member of my family for going on 33 years. I have dealt with nothing but opposition from what LDS in-laws I have. I have not always liked or felt a part of the 25 or so wards I've been a member of in my years of moving around. People are people. I avoid cliques like the plague. BUT WHETHER IT FILLS MY SOCIAL NEEDS OR NOT (or business?? I pay 10% of my income to the church....), I CANNOT DENY THAT THIS CHURCH HOLDS THE RESTORED FULLNESS OF THE GOSPEL WITH ALL ITS RESTORED PRIESTHOOD COVENANTS WHICH YOU ARE BLASPHEMING. OFIT IS THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST. If you want to believe God does not have a church on the earth at this time, then by all means, take it upon yourself to lead the way you think you are doing. But I stand as a witness to tell you that YOU ARE WRONG SIR. I've watched your attitude toward the truth get more and more vicious. You have rejected light. And then use the chemtrails to blame your issues on. You may want to watch out, Russ. Remember that post about those who have blasphemed God/Jesus and put themselves above them? That is exactly what satan tried to do, too.

Russ:We must be strong.

Jeanie: Yes, we must. Russ, you have some good beliefs and stances. There are most definitely evil and conspiring men running things. I have learned a lot on this site. I believe your heart is good, but you are literally turning from light on this.....And I fear you have no excuse having been taught as much as you say you have. But only the Lord can judge that... I won't judge nor condemn you the way you have me. The sad truth is that you are turning away from the very source that could heal you.....

If you want to ban me, go for it. Or at least tell me how the heck to unsubscribe. I don't want to at this time, but if I'm not allowed to speak my mind just as you have....show your colors and ban me.




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