Bex,

I understand your frustration. The catholic church gets attacked a lot.

I also have seen the goodness of your heart and how you've given to the people here on the forum. You've done so much good and helped so many people.

(No doubt, the catholic church also does good. It has many beneficent sub-organizations and does good work all around the world. The mormon church and masons do good work as well.)

It is our job as Christians to teach truth and reveal deception, and the best I can say without writing a book is that the core—not the common people—of the catholic church is clearly—to be and based on my research—the ante-church. It is the "system" that the Bible refers to when it talks about the city on seven hills, and this is not the only proof text I rely on. This is just one example. These things are very clear to me, and I am not blinded by a love of or an affiliation to anyone except Christ and the Bible

God lead me supernaturally to the Church of Christ when I was soon to become a Christian. You may have read my testimony here on this forum.

I later discovered that the Church of Christ is scripturally off in deeper issues, but it was a great place to gain the fundamentals, and I did. God led me there under no uncertain terms, and it benefited me, but I eventually left when I grew all that I could there.

So you see, the COC served its purpose in that it helped me get a good fundamental base from which to study, for they are very strict about fundamentals. They do have strange ideas about deeper prophecy though.

The catholic may also by used the same way of God. Many people (hopefully) get a base there, and then when they become more educated, they move on.

I'm truly glad that you know that I have no purpose to offend. I don't and it's important to me that you know that.



Honestly, I have studied the deeper doctrine of catholicism over a long period of time, and the problems I see are many. I am not making hasty statements.

I also applaud you for putting links up and defending your position, because you are defending something that you believe to be misunderstood. But I will not discount my position either. I have done a lot of homework on the issues I speak about. When others are out playing games and having fun, I am often studying.

That's what this forum is good at. You state your position. I'll state mine. Then, we both have to have enough faith in God and in His ability to guide the onlookers that they will be guided into truth; That they will be able to discern the truth from untruth.

If you believe Christ is who He said He was, then you and I are brother/sister regardless of what organization you attend for worship. It's only important that we both continue growing, and challenging each other on deeper issues is part of that growing process. In fact, that's why God put us here on Earth along with evil (which also challenges us). It's not a mistake. It's God's way of putting us through the fire which purifies gold. It all has a purpose.



I would not judge an organization by its attendees. This is why I continually refer to deeper doctrine. We're looking at the core of the organization including it's leaders, not the attendees.



You will find that the most common cause of error in one's understanding of truth comes not from how well someone knows the Bible. It comes from what idols someone holds.

Idols blind.

Part of the search for truth is to let go of all presuppositions, emotions, and personal agendas. This is part of what Christ means by denying ourselves.

The beauty of truth is that babes are sometimes more equipped to see it as they are not blinded by idols. No one is exempt from this source of blindness and we must all continually check ourselves.

I'm sure Jack means well, but he also has a financial interest in not offending the catholic church. Has this become a blinding idol to him? I don't know, but if his position on the catholic church is scripturally inaccurate, then it is entirely possible. It happens to us adults all the time.



This is a great example, in my opinion, of scripture taken out of context. The catholic proof text for this belief is fundamentally flawed, in my opinion.

The Holy Spirit is the current leader of the Church. This is how God is closer to us than a brother. This is why we are the temple now. He is in us and guides us. The holy of holies has been opened to us and there is no need for a vicar. We have the real Thing in us.

A lot could be written on this, and we can go on if you like, but I simple believe this is man attempting to put himself in the position of God. As I stated previously, deep catholic doctrine considers the pope to be the ante-Christ; "Ante" meaning "in place of".

The mormon church does the same type of thing with their church leaders and apostles.



Please know that I am not speaking about corruption. I'm speaking about deep doctrine. This is where you find the true nature of organizations.



The Bible says, "A spiritual man judges all things." We truly need to be careful knowing that deception is everywhere.



And you will not see them. They are not shown to the common people because most people would leave the church and that would be financially devastating for the organization. You can begin to see the true nature of an organization by looking at its deep doctrine.

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I would be sure to carefully examine both sides of this issue, and do you best to have no bias, in as much as that is possible.

All I can say in all honesty is that my studies have very clearly shown me that the root and core of the catholic is a false church, an "ante" (in place of) church.

If you have found differently, great. Post links. Display information, and have enough faith in people to let them decide. Just don't let your personal connection to this organization divide our brotherhood/sisterhood, as that's exactly what idols are designed to do; Exactly.

I don't doubt that you and many of your catholic friends are true Christians.

Christ warned us that as we grow in the knowledge of the truth, that we would have to make many difficult decisions.