Originally Posted by LinearAq
ikester,

I see that you are showing how the sheep and goats parable fits in with the "saved by grace" theology. I think you are making a lot of sense with it.

However, I am having a little problem understanding it completely.

Are people who come to Christ before they die, not required to be judged as sheep or goats? From what you wrote, it seems that both saved and unsaved people will be judged by that standard and punished in the same way.


Everyone stands judgement.

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The problem is that some hear preaching of Christ and sin, yet still don't believe. They don't believe a particular act is a sin. I understand willful disobedience requires severe punishment, but what about those who simply don't see that Christ is the Savior even though they have heard (but not comprehended) the Gospel message? Do they get that second chance after they die?


For two reasons some will, some won't.

1) For God to be no respecter of persons means He "has to" treat everyone fairly in judgement. Regardless of what any person claims, He will already know whether they had the opportunity or not. There won't be anyone skating by. Fo God to make "any" person more able to enter heaven or hell becuase of like or dislike, He from that point forward becomes an unjust judge.

2) Being a just judge means that God gives everyone equal chance. He has the line drwn already to where a person can enter heaven or hell even before each person appears before him. The judgement here will not be like it is on earth. There won't be innocent people in jail (hell) like we have here. And there won't be guilty people roaming free (in heaven) like we have here.

The rules for the judgement are already laid out. Just like man lays out the laws of the land for one amother. Except here, there are no witnesses needed. Your life is already known. And it will be shown what you did when given the oportunity, and what you thought as well. That is something the courts here on earth cannot do.

Example 1: What if you could actually see what someone was thinking at the time they committed a murder? What if you saw that they not only did it, but through their thoughts actually enjoyed it?

Example 2: Let's say there were no witnesses to a crime. But you could look into that person's mind and see if they did it or not. How would that change things? No one on this earth would get away with anything. And no one who was innocent who be punished for something they did not do.

These are the things that make God:
1) No respecter of persons. Because he can see all. Even into you heart and mind.
2) A just judge. Which means no one goes to where they are not supposed to.

Now how just would judgement be on earth if any of us actually had the ability to judge like that? So God will know who had the chance and did not take it. God will know who did not truly understand what was being offerred. God will know who never had a chance. And God will know who knew it all, and has no excuse.

Arguing and pleading with God will make no difference because he will know what you did even before you appear before Him. But, being a just judge, He also has to show you why you get what ever judgement you get.

How would you feel if our court system could run like that? You'd be highly impressed as I would also. But also know for those who think the judgement of God is like it is here on earth. And that some how a lawyer will appear and get them off for the things thet did. It won't happen.

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Example: Buddhists who follow their religion's teaching will meet the requirements of the sheep and goats parable. However, they don't believe that Christ is the Son of God. Of course they will confess that He is once they are at the judgment. So what judgment will they receive?


If they truly "never" heard of Christ. Or did not have access to the word. Then God will alow them to pass through the fire to be judged on the other end. Remember, I can only speculate how God will look at people like this. But being just means that He has to look at people who never had the chance as innocent.

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Makes sense...so that these "innocents" will have a chance to be saved. I would say that they have a better chance than those who are witnessed to here on Earth because they will see Christ and Hell for themselves so there is no doubt. However, this seems to be an argument to stop preaching the Gospel so that less people have a chance to reject Him. Let's face it, if you're in a lake of boiling lava and some guy is standing on the shore saying "follow me and I will get you out of there", you're not going to think twice about following Him.

BTW: Could you provide the Bible passages that show Christ did/will preach in Hell?



1 Peter 3:18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;

Just and the unjust means that the innocent of the unjust, Christ had to die for their sins also. Innocent are those who never had the knowledge, or option to choose Christ.


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