Thanks everyone for all the info so far. Has anyone had either of the Cliffords or Scientific Health tests recently - say in the last 6 to 12 months? Can you advise when and how much (please indicate what currency you are using) it cost you?
Bex I had already come accross that Bikerchick's info in the Curezone Forum. She also says -
"Hal Huggins invented the ORIGINAL SERUM BIOCOMPATIBILITY TEST. He and Walter Clifford once worked together. They later had a falling out and Clifford went off on his own. He made his own test based on the same blood test but he was only able to obtain partial disclosure from the dental product companies as to the ingredients. Hal Huggins had full disclosure, but they only were willing to give it to one person. Hal Huggins has since sold his test to Dr. Levy. Dr Levy’s company is Scientific Health Solutions (SHS) which has purchased the laboratory operation previously owned by Peak Energy Performance(PEP). Hal Huggin’s confirmed that Scientific Health Solutions (SHS) has full disclosure from the dental product companies as to ingredients in Dental Materials. Walter Clifford’s has confirmed that Clifford Consulting & Research Inc (Clifford Consulting) - Clifford Materials Reactivity Testing (CMRT) only has partial disclosure from the dental product companies as to the ingredients in Dental Materials. Walter is a nice person and he that he feels his test is adequate"
However I think that this statement was made a couple of years back. Do you (or anyone else ) know if that is still the case? Obviously if SHS test has full disclosure I would probably go with their test.
I have a reply to the email I sent to Cliffords. Here is the email I sent -
"I am currently considering Dental Revision and became aware of your Serum Compatibility test via the Herb Allure Dental Amalgam Forum. I have already had MELISA testing which shows extremely strong allergy to Mercury, allergy to Lead and Cobalt and weak allergy to Gallium. Unfortunately I find this is little help in deciding on choice of Dental Materials as many manufacturers do not fully disclose ingredients. I am therefore seeking more info on your testing. I cannot find any Australian Labs that do this testing. I am located in Perth Western Australia. Is it possible to have samples taken here and sent to you for testing? How exactly is this done and How much would it cost? (nb. I have read all the info on your site) I would like to arrange to have both the test kit and the test results sent to me directly. I have limited options regarding Dentists. The two I have used in the past decade do not use any protocols so I will not be using them. I have recently consulted two other Dentists. The first does limited protocols but did not want to do my revision. The second does more of the protocols but only uses specific Dental Materials. I see little point considering using this Dentist or continuing to search for another until I have some idea what materials I might be compatible with. Most dentists will not even tell you what materials they use unless you make an appointment and incur several hundred dollars in fees! Even when I do find out what they use the Dentist doesn't know the composition/materials used and expects me to make enquiries and tell them if it is OK to use on me. Certainly NONE of the local Dentists are aware of, never mind familiar with, Serum Testing and would not be able to interpret test results. This is why I need the kit & report sent to me. Can you also tell me if the Trade Name products you advise on suitability are ones commonly available to Australian dentists? I have come across the DRM Diamond range mentioned favourably for compatibility on several Internet sources but so far have been unable to find any local dentist that uses their products. I would appreciate any advice in that area if you are aware of local Dentists who use it? I look forward to hearing from you soon."
And here is their reply-
"Thank you for your inquiry. The Clifford Materials Reactivity Test is an Antibody screening test and looks for systemic sensitivities to dental products. In Australia the two sources that we could point you to are the IAOMT Australian Chapter
www.asomat.com which can be accessed through Dr Roman Lohyn or Dr Robert Gammal.
Dr. Roman Lohyn
175 Collins St. 8th Floor
Melbourne 3000
T: 011-61-3-9650-1660
lohyn@melbpc.org.auDr. Robert Gammal
40 Duffield Rd.
102/ 222 Pitt Street
Sydney 2000
New South Wales
T: 011-61-2-9264-5195
Robert@visionthang.comThe IAOMT (International Academy of Oral Medicine and Toxicology) helps train and educate medical professionals. They would be a very good source for dental referrals. Also in Australia is a dentist, Dr Nigel Cluer, that we have worked with and is familiar with our testing. DrCluer can be reached at:
Brunswick Heads Holistic Dental Centre
6/18 Mullumbimbi St.
Brunswick heads
NSW 2483
02-6685-1742
Your last request about trade names is a little harder for us to answer. The Clifford Materials Reactivity Test is started and is still based out of the United States. The Products listed can be order internationally,however, we do know that there are some products in other countries that are not available in the US and may not be on the test. Once you have found a dentist that you feel comfortable with for your dentistry, they can request a testing kit for you. The request does need to come from the Professional's office for legal reasons here in the US. Getting the results sent directly too you will not be too difficult. There is two ways to get this accomplished. You can have your dentist's office request that results be sent to you either when the kit is order or when you send the sample back to us. We always send two copies of the results. The other way is to have you fill out a form that can be included with the test kit that requests one of the two copies be sent to you. The testing kits will come with packaging materials to get the sample back to us for testing as well as prepaid FedEx return shipping materials and an order form that will need to be field out and sent in with the sample. Please let us know if you have any questions regarding this information."
My comments on reply -
-they have not answered my enquiry re costs at all
-they have not answered my enquiry re Diamond product range at all
-they will not deal with you directly but require the Dentist to request the kit which will be sent not to you but to the Dentist
-why do they do this?They say it is due to USA legal requirements but Scientific Health Solutions will send both the kit and results direct to you and does not require Dentist Referral/Request?
- the results will be sent to the Dentist (together with a second copy for the patient unless the Dentist agrees to request that the second copy be sent to you)
-their response to my statement in my email that no local dentist has experience or familiarity with the testing and will not know how to interpret results is to suggest 1 Dentist who lives thousands of miles away?
So in order to do their testing requires
-an appointment with the Dentist to advise them you want a test
-they don't explain how the Dentist is supposed to do this? They can't ring due to the 15 hour time zone difference. Our business hours 9am to 5pm are 6am to 2am USA time. Very few Dentists have internet access, websites or even email addresses?
-assuming I can find one who can arrange to get a kit somehow another appointment will be required to collect the kit
- another appointment needed with my GP to get referral (Dentists don't do that in Australia) to Path Lab to have blood drawn, go to Lab get blood drawn, return to Lab when sample processed, arrange for collection by courier for transport of sample to Lab in USA
-wait for phone call from Dentist's office that results received
-another appointment with Dentist in order to get a copy of the results which I would have to explain/interpret to them anyway
-may well have to find another Dentist if the most suitable materials are not offered by that dentist (most likely scenario as explained in original email Dentists here offer limited choice of dental materials)
All of which means that the cost of doing the Cliffords test will be doubled if not tripled by the cost of appointments required to comply with their procedural requirements? Not to mention that it will take probably 2-3 months to organise? Usually 2-3 week wait to schedule Dental appointments and about 7-10 days to schedule a GP appointment. Then add transport time to USA, Lab processing time and postage time to receive results?
Its a 'Catch-22' situation. Need the results in order to make a decision as to who is a "suitable Dentist". Need a Dentist in order to get tested and get the results?!?!?
I thought the idea was to empower the patient/consumer by providing them with the information needed to make an informed educated decision about their own health care? Not to put additional procedural and financial obstacles in their way? By the way none of the test, lab or transport costs will be covered by either Medicare or private medical insurance in this country. Needless to say I will be emailing Cliffords about all the above points.
Comments responses anyone please?
