I heard so many good things about hesham and want to see him but he doesnt use these safety protocols which worries me. Is it neccessary by todays standards or not?

James.

James, As far as I understand, it is very necessary to use the rubber dam and oxygen supply. For myself, I didn't know about quadrant order at the time, so I didn't have that done. I kind of wonder, though, if it would have helped more if I had done that. I'm happy to hear that you are checking these things out. IMHO, I wouldn't settle for less than you have learned to be safe.

James, this is worrying, a rubber dam is probably the most important thing for protecting you. I wouldnt entertain getting mercury drilled out without one.
Dawn.

My dentist did not use a rubber dam for amalgam removal, but a suction device called 'clean-up' (I think). This was placed over each tooth as he drilled, and it sucks up the vapour as it is released. My dentist said he did not rate rubber dams, as it was likely that mercury particles would fall down the side. I can't tell if I was exposed to more mercury vapour than I would have been with a rubber dam, and I was pretty sick anyway.

Certainly, the procedure without a rubber dam was much more comfortable - they can be very difficult to get on properly.

Check what the dentist is using - if he is using the suction device you won't need a rubber dam. Oxygen supply is good in all cases.

Best
Nicola

I cannot believe that he is not using them, they are standard protocol, especially for someone who is already mercury toxic...I would definitely look for someone else ASAP!!!

Best luck,
Sandi
xoxo

James Im torn as well in dentistry.

I plan on seeing hesham since his protocol says he will guarantee no mercury in the tooth and will recover in a year or money back but heard he doesnt use a rubber dam.

I was planning on seeing austin but then alot of people said they had problems and had to see hesham to sort them out (not sure if they are linked to hesham though).

its all very confusing and hope you figure it all out.

I had no rubber dam in the early stages of amalgam removal, but had it in the second and noticed no difference.

Personally, I prefer that my dentist use a rubber dam. It's true that some mercury will leak through and it is uncomfortable, but I believe it helps keep some mercury out of your mouth (where you can absorb it) and out of the lungs.

My dentist also used a mixture of activated charcoal and chlorella under my tongue which was washed out and replaced between each quadrant. This further helps reduce mercury exposure; A very good idea, I believe.

Thanks for your replies.

Why do they say he is the best dentist for mercury removal when he doesnt use any of that stuff.

I emailed him and he said chlorella and Activated charcoal are a waste of time when used in mouth.

Im wanting to go to harvey austin but people on here saying they failed to recover seeing him even though HE DOES ALL THE PRECAUTIONS. Why is this? ANd they get better seeing hesham...I find that these people are trying to get people to only go to hesham..Besides hesham wants to do it his way only and sedation etc

You really have to reseach your dentist cause you have to know that you have the best treatment available, and even then, nothing is a sure bet!!!

Sandi
xoxo

Thanks but I dont understand anymore. I hear too many contradictions on hear about dentists.
I think they are related or try and persuade me away.

It can be frustrating, James. I know. When I first had my amalgams out, I felt like you...only in the sense that I didn't know which protocol to follow. One said that this chelator was the only one to use, and another was just as convincing that it was completely unsafe. I ended us frustrated wondering where to go. Truth is, I wouldn't recommend the dentist that I used, though he was highly recommended to me.

For what it's worth, I don't think that people are related as much as they are passionate about the dentist that they see. Some of us don't realize that what works for us may not work for someone else.

Research safe removal of mercury amalgam. Mercola, Huggins, Cutler, etc. You will find that, at least, a rubber dam should be used. My dentist used a rubber dam and put sunglasses on me and his personnel. There was a suction cup in my mouth and my face was covered with a cloth. This is a highly toxic substance that they are removing from your mouth. From what I have read, second only to plutonium. When a dentist takes it out of our mouths, he can't throw it away in the garbage, he can't touch it with his bare hands, and it must be treated as a toxic waste. That is how serious safe removal is. So, if some seem passionate about rubber dams and suction devices, it's because they care. I'm sure that the others do, too. But, please, be careful.

Not all dentists use the same protocol..there are many protocols around. A rubber dam is not vital because there are other options which are far BETTER than a rubber dam. With a rubber dam particles of amalgam can get underneath it and then be swallowed by the patient. As long as the patient's teeth are isolated from their throat and an alternative air supply is used (which Hesham does, I might add), the patient is safe from particles being swallowed or inhaled. Conscious sedation is used to make this more comfortable for the patient.

Both Hesham El-Essawy and David Harvie-Austin are brilliant dentists. Each using their own method. As people will know on here, I've stated before that the best dentist in the UK is Hesham, but if I had to choose another, it would be David. I have known many people to fully recover after being treated by both dentists, but only by following what they have been told by them to the letter.

Detoxing is the most important part of the whole procedure. One cannot fully recover without a full detox after removal. This can take months or even years. Most people who do not see a great difference in their health in a few months feel their dentist has let them down and so call him/her a bad dentist. But it's usually because they have either stopped, or cut down on their detoxing. Pam Clayton, who also runs a Helpline in the UK for amalgam poisoning sufferers used a different dentist entirely as she does not live in London where they have their practices. Although he didn't do any tests before, during or after removal of her fillings, he was mercury-free, and it took her 3 years to detox the mercury from her body.

Because Pam's dentist did not use a mercury vapour analyser and temporary fillings were not put in situ first, it was found that she had some pieces of amalgam still in her teeth, under her new permanent fillings and of course, this affected her health once again. After being well for 3 years she began to get ill again. When a mercury vapour analyser is used during removal this makes sure that all the mercury has been removed but just in case a minute particle or vapour has been left in, temporary fillings are used. Once detoxing has been successful and the mercury reading is nil, you can be sure that all the mercury has gone and it is safe to have permanent fillings put in. It would be a very expensive procedure if permanent fillings were put in straight away only to find that you may have tiny pieces of amalgam which escaped the analyser's reading under some of your new filings and have to have them removed and replaced at a future date.

You cannot expect to get well again if you do not follow what the dentist wants to do fully.

Lyn Rennick
www.LynRennicksAMPSsociety.co.uk
Lyn@LynRennicksAMPSsociety.co.uk

Okay so, James, back to what you were talking about and more or less to answer your question. There are many different protocols and many different "best" dentists out there. I don't think that anyone on this forum cares to get back on the "my dentist is best" bandwagon. This is a free forum where people are entitled to different opinions and different dentists. This forum is not dedicated to any dentist or his protocol.

James, If you care to go to a dentist whose protocol you truly agree with............that is great and we wish you the best. I, however, feel that you need to take your rubber dam concern seriously. Please look at this link http://www.holisticmed.com/dental/amalgam/iaomt.txt
It shows the International Academy of Oral Medicine and Toxicology protocol for mercury/silver filling removal.

Granted, this is for the States and not the UK. Just the same they are an agency that is concerned about safe amalgam removal. Hope that this helps. It isn't meant to step on toes, just to give two sides of the coin. This way you can make an informed decision for yourself.

Kathi <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

James-

For any opinion out there, you can find the exact opposite opinion. Therefore, you need to be the judge yourself and decide what removal methods makes sense to YOU. If you go through life letting others make your decisions, you will end up unhappy and broke.

Here's what makes sense to me:

Rubber dams should be used. It makes sense. I have seen many dentists who claim to be mercury free gurus, and yet they refuse to use a rubber dam. WHY?? Because rubber dams make THEIR job more difficult. Meanwhile YOU get exposed to more mercury.

* many benefits really only benefit the dentist, and cost you health and money.

I read of a dentist who used an actual vacuum cleaner or shop vac to suck the amalgam vapors/mercury out of the patient's mouth, blowing it outside the window. That would work better than any tiny overpriced dental gadget that claims to suck up all of the mercury. That's my kind of dentist who uses his head and makes sense!

Oxygen supply should be used. An oxygen mask on the patient doesn't protect the dentist so most dentists don't want to be bothered using it.

What doesn't make sense to me?

Quadrant removal order, filling removal order, refusing to chelate before amalgams are removed. All this stuff is spewed all over these forums but they make absolutely no sense to me, partly because no one has explained the exact reasoning behind these dogmas. Dentists who charge insane amounts use these methods to make multiple appointments and to puff up the sales pitch, or just to make them seem more knowledgeable about their procedures.

Dentists are salesmen. Most will make all sorts of claims and "puff" their marketing with "flair and balloons" like a used car salesman to justify the prices they charge. Personally I don't give a rats [censored] if the dentist has a huge waiting room, a tv with stereo surround sound, aroma therapy, mandibular massaging, marble flooring, micro video capability, Sharper Image air purifiers, and all of the other flair to sell people on image and flair instead of function. I don't need to spend $400 for an initial appointment so the dentist can spend 2 hours lecturing me on how bad mercury is for me. The gall some of these dentists have when they are preying on desperate and sick people. That $400 doesn't translate into value for you, it is $400 because that's what the dentist can charge. If he has a backlog of patients for months, he can start refusing patients, or just raise the price to $400 until some patients go away. That's capitalism/marketing for you - good for the dentist but not necessarily good for you.

"Rubber dams should be used. It makes sense. I have seen many dentists who claim to be mercury free gurus, and yet they refuse to use a rubber dam. WHY?? Because rubber dams make THEIR job more difficult. Meanwhile YOU get exposed to more mercury."

Rick: Re: The above statement.
Couldn't have said it better myself. Though it isn't a statement that I could make based on personal experience, I'm, also, tempted to agree with you on quadrant order.

thanks everyone for replies

I for one found Lyn Rennicks answer very informative and had the rubber dam used for my first mercury removal, and how did that work?
When I left the dentist I stood outside a parked car of the type I had 5 years ago trying to get in and wondered why my keys wouldn't open it, when I finally found my present car, I drove off to the cash machine put my card in and wandered off without my money and later wondered why I didnt have any thing to pay for my kids lunch!
I don't care if anyone goes to my dentist or not.

I for one found Lyn Rennicks answer very informative and had the rubber dam used on my first round of amalgam removal, and how did that work?
When I left the dentist I stood outside a parked car of the type I had owned at least 5 years previously and wondered why my key wouldn't work. When I finally found my car, Í drove off to the cash machine and wandered off without waiting for my money and later wondered why I didn't have any thing to give my kids for lunch money.Things pretty much stayed like this for the next 7 years.
I don't care if anyone goesto my dentist or not.

I for one found Lyn Rennicks answer very informative and had the rubber dam used on my first round of amalgam removal, and how did that work?
When I left the dentist I stood outside a parked car of the type I had owned at least % years previously and wondered why my key wouldn't work. When I finally found my car, Í drove off to the cash machine and wandered off without waiting for my money and later wondered why I didn't have any thing to give my kids for lunch money.
I don't care if anyone goesto my dentist or not.

I meant 5 yrs, oops still have a way ot go I guess.
cheers

Chelation with fillings in can be problematic for the body. This is because mercury in the fillings provides an endless pool of mercury which chelation can draw upon which will end up getting redistributed around the body doing further damage. The process is bad enough when all mercury has been removed from the mouth without drawing and adding more to the body burden.

James,

You're so right. This subject is very confusing.

One of the reasons is that we're on the "cutting edge" so to speak. Doctors are not trained in this subject. Dentists are being outright lied to, and the media—who receives hundreds of millions in pharmaceutical advertising dollars—refuses to talk about it.

The pharmaceutical companies are making unimaginable amounts of money treating diseases and conditions that are actually related to mercury exposure and they know it.

The ADA owes no legal duty of care... in their own words.

Our only real advocates for our cause are each other, and a few good doctors (Boyd Haley, Russell Blaylock, for example) who are willing to stand up in the face of ridicule and tell the truth.

For these reasons, there has not yet been established procedures and protocols that have been widely accepted. This makes us all responsible to do our own research and make our own decisions, which can be hard when you're already bogged down with the bran fog and other symptoms mercury creates.

In the end, it all comes down to common sense. In my opinion, if there is a protection available to you during removal, opt FOR it, if possible.

There are indeed dentists having success with many different methods of removal, you just have to choose the one that you feel most confident about. That's just part of the deal when you're on the cutting edge.

Take your time and make your decisions carefully and you will succeed.

All the best.

From Hesham El-Essawy


Dear All,

By way of clarification please note that:

1. I do not use rubber dam because IT DOES NOT PROVIDE ENOUGH PROTECTION FOR THE PATIENT. My simple methods on the other hand ensure total protection as it depends on building multilayered barriers between the teeth and the throat hence the total protection for the patient. However, we need sedation to make that tolerable for the patient.

2. Using the quadrant removal order serves no good purpose.

3. Using charcoal serves no good purpose either, as it will not adsorb mercury vapour once it gets wet.

4. Chlorella removes no mercury, as shown by our experiments.

5. Removing amalgam in stages will only result in mercury vapour coming out of the amalgam that has not been removed only to hidre under the white fillings that were placed. All amalgam must be removed at once in order to prevent this from happening.

In a general response to all the points raised, may I quote the Arab Andalucian scientist ibn sinna who once said, “Your hypothesis might be valid, but why not try the experiment?” The methods we adopt came about after careful examination and after subjecting them to the all important experimentation.

Best wishes.

Hesham

You'd have a better grip of the real situation if you experimented on yourself and suffered the consequences likewise.

I like this:
"However, we need sedation to make that tolerable for the patient'.

and this:
"3. Using charcoal serves no good purpose either, as it will not adsorb mercury vapour once it gets wet."

sounds evil to me. First he sedates you so you will not ever know how much mercury got washed down your drain, umm I mean throat or what else went on... and then he wants me to believe that the purpose of the charcoal is to absorb mercury vapor as though only mercury vapor is the problem. Was he intending to stick the charcoal in your nose? No wonder they need sedation. Tell me please, what exactly happens to the mercury vapor after IT gets wet?

I really like this:
"5. Removing amalgam in stages will only result in mercury vapour coming out of the amalgam that has not been removed only to hidre under the white fillings that were placed. All amalgam must be removed at once in order to prevent this from happening."

... he sounds very concerned about mercury vapor 'hiding' under your new fillings... but he doesn't give a hoot about it hiding under your tongue or in your nose or down your throat..

I think you should avoid this so-called dentist because he gave you his answer right there... mercury will be hiding all over your mouth as you are sadly sedated in his office chair.

quack quack quack.

Arab Andalucian scientist ibn sinna, you must be kidding, did someone post that as a joke?

one thing im confused with is. if your not using a rupper dam.how can you completly block the mouth..
yes you can probably block the throat. but how can you completely block the surronding gum margins,tounge, inside cheek etc, without a rubber dam. surely anything thats exposed. when removing amalgam. will be absorbed through skin. eg. cheek,tounge.

I think Hesham has answered his own questions and shot himself in the foot good website not so good dentist at least hes been on and people can now see how much he really knows about the whole protocol

Sorry, this part really made me especially suspicious --

Hesham wrote:

"My simple methods on the other hand ensure total protection as it depends on building multilayered barriers between the teeth and the throat hence the total protection for the patient. However, we need sedation to make that tolerable for the patient."

It's like he feels he's developed some special, SECRET, proprietary technique for safe removal. It it's so simple why is it secret? Why not elaborate the safety measures used? And if it's so effective in protecting patients, why not fully disclose the technique? What sort of multi-layered technique is used? What materials are used? Why does the patient need to be sedated in order for it to be safe?

Talk about uniformed consent! I wouldn't want any dentist to approach my mouth unless I knew, understood, and agreed with everything he was doing.

Hesham wrote:

"may I quote the Arab Andalucian scientist ibn sinna who once said, “Your hypothesis might be valid, but why not try the experiment?” The methods we adopt came about after careful examination and after subjecting them to the all important experimentation."


Precisely what type of experiments have you performed and under what circumstances and situations? Were your experimentations done on people? Have any of your experiments failed or produced undesirable results? If so, what were those results? How would you compare (via results of experimentation) between using a rubber dam, for example, and your secret "multilayered" technique to block the teeth from the throat?

While it's nice to have a dentist engage in dialogue here, I find that each time Hesham posts he raises more questions in my mind then I had before. And my questions are mostly categorized as to the true quality (or lack thereof) of said dentist. Sorry to sound so blunt, but I find myself quite flummoxed.

I would not pay for the services of a dentist who uses secret techniques and experimentation. I'm lead to believe that this is so because of Hesham's unwillingness to fairly disclose his removal procedures.

Perhaps I'm over-reacting and jumping to conclusions. But I trust no one -- least of all, dentists. I'm curiously reminded of Dr. Frankenstein and now my imagination has gone wild with images of Dr. Heshamstein. Sorry, but that's just how I'm feeling right now.

Dr. Hesham, if you care to elaborate on any of the above questions, I'm all ears.

LOL!

Well, we can be sheeple or we can be people,6 people responded to this thread and not a one of them is really talkin from any first hand knowledge. BAH BAH BAH
The first people who said the world is round were regarded as lunatics, do y'all REALLY put so much faith in to the rubber dam? There is definately more than one way to skin a cat and gettin rid a mercury is kinda similar,some folks are just plain better at doin it than others, ( and have their ways)in fact I positively don't want y'all flat earthers to go to my dentist,but I still get a bit riled at a group disembowelling. Especially when y'all don't know what y'all are talkin about, and you can have the rest a my stars...its kinda the bendin end, plus I detect a little lack a cultural awareness here.

From Dr Hesham El-Essawy.

To the anonymous poster and his colleagues who think that I am an evil quake ‘Dr Heshamstein’ and that I keep my methods secret etc, please note that my methods are on public record for the last 17 years. All you have to do is log onto my website and have a look at the power point presentation thereon. You do not have to be ‘all ears’ for that, one open eye will do! An open mind will do even better! Anyone who is looking for my answers to these questions will, I hope, find them there.

The “flummoxed” posters should sleep restfully, comfortable in the knowledge that they are totally safe from my ‘Frankenstein methods’ that seem to have helped over two thousand patients so far.

Anyway, many thanks for the entertainment!

Dr ‘Heshamstein El-Essawystein’
www.el-essawy.com

LOL Dr. Hesham. Ok, I'll go have a look at your website to see an explanation of what this curious "multilayered barrier" technique is. I hope I'll find an answer to my questions there. I'm presuming I won't find a bunch of unsubstantiated hyperbole.

Too bad you weren't willing to share your views and elaborate on the other questions though. I was very curious to hear about the results (positive and negative) of your so-called experimentation. Given the fact that you're experimenting with such a potent poison (i.e., mercury) -- that sort of experimentation sounds like scary stuff, not only for dentist but for patient as well.

Signed,
Avoiding Dental Frankenstein's For Fear Of My Life, lol!

By the way, I forgot to add in the reply post immediately above this one that I used to have an open mind but my brain kept falling out.

Thank God, i'll prolly get an appointment when i want one now.Y'all better rattle your dags for the next feeding frenzy.
Anonymous , i love a good joke, that ones as dusty as your brain must be from fallin on the floor so dang much,
cheers!

I have to admit, when I first started amalgam removal I had no rubber dam. I didn't even know about them then. I relied totally on the assistant using the suction.

My later amalgams were removed with all the protection. I noticed NO difference, if anything, coincidence I don't know, I was worse. In fact, I had a rubber dam yet swallowed the removed amalgam. Perhaps bcause it's easier trapped or not seen as clearly or the fact the assistant didn't take as much care and got sloppy because I had a dam on. At any rate, they removed the dam, and didn't remove the amalgam. I swallowed it.

I was extremely ill after that removal. So I can't say the dam seemed to make any difference. To me, if anything, they maybe less careful with their removal and clean up. When there is no dam, they tend to be ultra cautious and the suction is used non stop and very very exact.

Also on my last removal, I also had goggles to protect my eyes. yet the odd thing was, I was still much sicker than my previous "no protection" removals. Though I know mercury vapor is very bad, how is it I was far sicker from swallowing mercury than I was with the no protection removals? I was poisoned so badly from it, that I twitched on the way home in the car. My face, lips everything.

I then developed headaches and crying. Yet people said swallowing mercury wasn't a big deal. Well if that was the case, I'd not have gotten such a dramatic bad reaction and it's not as though it improved in a day. I had to chelate for sometime to even remotely improve that but I was worse off than I had been prior.

So protection is only as good as the dentist is careful. If they think that they have all the protection, therefore they can be a little more slapdash, it will undo any good that extra protection could have done for that patient.

God bless you Bex and I mean that from the bottom of my heart.And the top.
It's a wonder you can think at all with the horrors y'all have been through but ya got a decent head there ,what would you be like without this poisoning? Its a cryin shame.

To be honest with everyone I did have some doubts with hesham not using a Rubber dam. I did some research and the rubber dam isnt essential as their are many other things that are even more safer from what I seen and the rubber dam isnt %100 Gauranteed to protect you etc. It does help though.

I think you just have to believe in the dentist you choose and their protocol.

I plan on visiting Hesham from Birmingham soon. I like the idea of Sedation(Its much more pleasant and quicker) and you get it all done in one go and not to mention he offers a Money back gaurantee if you dont notice any improvements etc.

I doubt he would allow you to swallow amalgam when your sedated...(This did scare me when I read it) but he wouldnt offer a money back gaurantee.

Their is alot of different ways of treating many different things. I think everyone just has to go by what they believe in.

Hi, thanks Elvis! That means a lot to hear that. Who knows where we'd all be without this. You gotta wonder. It's a crying shame for sure!! This stuff never should have been allowed in dentistry, but it was and is and here we all are attempting to fix something that wasn't done by us in the first place.

I am getting rather tired of hearing about Hesham's so-called money back guarantee if his treatment doesn't improve his patients' health. Just how long are they expected to wait?
I think it is about time he put his (or more accurately their) money where his (or their) mouth is, and start paying them back (financially of course) for his lack of success.

Who's complaining?
All that nice puffed -up word weaving up there reminds me a Donald Trump's toupé, kinda covers the subject but you know its wrong.With all them words at your command couldn't ya think up somethin better than anonymous? It's been done to death and it gets confusing I mean, is there ONE of you or are you a several headed beast?
I digress, but I'm not sure I heard anyone complain about Hesham's merc. removal from anyone who has actually had that done by him, we all got complex health issues.
Where did you have your amalgams removed?

Hesham has helped alot of people.

http://www.stephenmacallan.co.uk/mercury.htm

He has also helped alot of people on here who have had amalgam left over from new white composites place during amalgam removal from other dentists.

Referrals are the best way to find any doctor/dentist for sure...I would get them firsthand though... and Hesham doesn't appear to follow the Huggins protocol, and if he does, he should state his case better and not leave loop holes such as suggesting that the mercury selectively retreats under new composite fillings without polluting any other areas.

I also wonder if he treats jews the same as his muslim clients since he is so forthcoming about his views on the Quran.

I agree, Sharon. With all due respect Elvis, and I am one of your real life as well as your fictionary life (on this forum) fans, when you say, "Who's complaining?" The answer is you do. You're sarcastic digs at anyone who disagrees with you can be hard to take, at times. Sometimes, it's funny. From some of the things you have to say, I believe that you have a knowledge about mercury toxicity. However, you need to lighten up on attacking one person after another.

This comment is unecessary and racist.

Yes, he does, re Jewish people , what, ya think maybe he doesn't quite give them enough anaesthetic?
Why don't y'all offer to re- write his website in regard to his lifes work and while you are at it you can remove all traces of his offensive (to you) spiritual beliefs.I am sure ya could do a much better job. Just don't expect the same tolerance for YOUR religious beliefs that you are so free with.
Y'all think the christians own the franchise on God?
Honestly, makes me ashamed to be American sometimes with this kind a ignorant statement.
P. S. Huggins ain't the god a dentistry neither
and furthermore, Hesham prolly knows more a the bible than you do.
Don't know why I bother sometimes...

Why is it unnecessary when his dentistry website declares his love of the Quran?

And why is it racist when the Quran itself dictates the slaughter of jews and all 'infidels' ?

I didn't write his website, I personally would never link my religious beliefs to dentistry as a profession, Hesham did that himself and I have to assume he has a reason for doing so.

Is it wrong for me to question it? If you want to impose Sharia law this probably isn't the place. If you have difficulty understanding that some people might be uncomfortable with a dentist who promotes the Quran, well obviously you have not traveled very far or seen very much.

Btw, I notice also that he does root canals, and most bio-compatible dentists have quite about a bit to say about that subject also.

Personally in my case, I am not sure which was worse, the root canal or the mercury poisoning.

I do apologize, anon (Whichever one you are) and I agree I was a little harsh with jill, and I humbly apologized once more. On this here thread we are talkin about a good dentist that some folks are gettin their kicks from ignorantly tryin to discredit. It's counter productive and I'm fresh out a apologies on this one subject, maybe re-read whats been written here about someone who has devoted over 30 years of their life on, they even try and shut Hesham up at dental conventions about his stance against mercury.
Gadzooks, y'all need to find another scapegoat.

Y'know what Elvis, it's great he takes a stance against mercury, but if he or anyone wants that stance to be taken seriously they need to maintain consistency and transparency and that is the big problem here, at least from my perspective, which is hardly unique.

I am not your anonymous poster btw.

Just to nail this one down, respectfully, so sick, there are a few new tecniques with root canals that a few bio-compatible dentists do here, even the Munro-Hall dentists do them and they are pretty kosher ( if you will) in the biological dentistry world, I don't think you have all the necessary info at your disposal. Personally, I am opposed, but only because I also had 2 bad ones done many years ago and they can be toxic.
As for your statements to do with the quran, are you an Islamic scholar? There are many different types of muslim, have you heard of Sufis, for example?
There are many interpretations of the bible, too.
I think it IS important to have an open mind, your brain really won't fall out. (I know you are not anonymous)
I try not to be irascible but they won't let me change my astrological sign, its a pain in the [censored] to me, too.
P.s. Heshams not into the Sharia law thing, just like all christians ain't fundamentalists

nope, not an islamic scholar, don't have to be to read the Quran, which plainly states.. all jews and infidels should be slaughtered,, with the sword i believe it was it says btw... you have never wondered why journalists and soldiers captured by islamic extremists are beheaded by a swordsman? Because the Quran dictates this Elvis. read it yourself, scholarship in islam is not required to do that simple thing. These are not 'interpretations'... these things are plainly stated in black and white within the Quran.

Probably Hesham is not an Islamic extremist. However since the Quran also directs that muslims should lie to non-muslims when appropriate, I could never trust this dentist because the little I do know about islam, and the behavior of muslims I have personally dealt with, is enough to tell me they adhere to the Quran before any other set of morals or law. And that they will lie to non-muslims in heartbeat. This is who they are. And you will never get a truthful answer from a muslim about it for that very reason. I know that in particular sounds odd and I know it sounds racist but you need to read the Quran yourself to know the truth in these matters. They are taught to lie to non-muslims Elvis, I'm sorry.

I cannot find any information in regard to Munro-Hall and root canal treatments though I can find quite a bit of information linking them to organizations they belong to which are strongly anti-root canal. They do however appear to do a good job cleaning out cavitations after root canals and extractions.


ps - I wouldn't say my mind was so open that my brain fell out... but for sure, my mind is not so open that anything can walk right in. I have experienced too much in this life to be quite so easily impressed anymore.

well, if you look at their price list, you will find they do root canals, if you wish to educate yourself further you could find out about their technique, I won't tell you about Hesham's technique but I strongly suggest that people do their own research and find things out for themselves instead of just parrot what this or that protocol dishes out.
I won't even go there on your views of ALL muslims, I think MY brain just fell out.
I wonder if anyone else has something to add on those views, I'm pretty lost for words but that should make some people very happy.
So maybe we are ending on a good note?
P.S. I got a good heart but sometimes a bad mouth,
I emailed Dr. Heshamstein and he says he can totally fix that with a good brain transplant,and I believe him, maybe I'll ask for a muslim one so I can satisfy myself about this all muslims are liars business.

I did not even see root canals on the price lists for their clinic that I came across. maybe you should post a link.

My view of muslims Elvis... there are muslims and there are MUSLIMS. I have muslim clients for instance. they were simply born that. they are also generally swift to offer that they are not devoted muslims, and they generally tell people that for a reason. Hesham is swift to offer that he is a devoted MUSLIM. And, I assume he generally tells people that for a reason.

He is obviously looking to cater to the devout muslim community and to comfort them with the idea that his views are the same as theirs.

I cannot think of any other reason someone would post their religious views on a dentistry website.

Confucus say - Never make vow to strange god or prophet to assuage dentist with high speed drill.

its right there, says root filling, bottom of the list on the left
My Uncle Floyd, part time chinese sage says never assume
P.S Does this mean that Dr. Wesley Shankland should not talk about his christian beliefs on his dental website?

From Heshamstein


Dear “SoSick”,

I am indeed a recognised Muslim scholar, and I know the Qur’an very well indeed, in fact I spent the evenings of the last thirty one years translating it.

Let me ask you, SoSick, where does it say in the Qur’an that Muslims should kill the Jews and infidels just because they are Jews or infidels? I will tell you, SoSick; NO WHERE AT ALL! The only type of fighting that the Qur’an permits against any one is in self-defence. The Qur’an clearly states, “Fight in the way of God only those who are fighting you, and do not become the aggressors, for God loves not the aggressors” 2:190.

SoSick, I hope that you will not take this as an offence, for no offence is intended here, but it seems to me, SoSick, that you have acutely understated your condition. I suggest you seek some very good help somewhere, for you cannot enjoy your life with the sort of attitude that you have. You must find out why you are like this.

Best wishes.

Heshamstein.

Oh, SoSick,

I forgot to say to you, not that it would have made a difference, that I am evidently not a liar.

I also am not here to discuss beliefs, I was merely trying to clarify a few things.

I do not follow the Huggins protocols because they are not adequate for patient protection. I have developed my own. I do not use rubber dam but I do not allow anything at all, vapour or particles, to go into the patient, and that is becuase I shield the patient's throat very well indeed. this is not at all kept as a secret, it is on the net for 17 years. most of my patients improve almost immediately or soon after amalgam removal because of that protocol. I have hundreds of videotaped case reports in which the patients say that for themselves. I take exceedingly good care of my patients because I know very well how they feel as I was there before. they deserve nothing less. I am not trying to convince anyone to come to me for treatment, I do not need to do that. I came on this forum to dispel some untruth written about me, and even 'SoSick' should be good enough to allow me to do that.

have a look if you wish at this link:
http://www.el-essawy.com/presentation_files/frame.html

SoSick, I sincerely wish you better.

hesham.

I have no issue with any dentist sharing his belief on his website. For some or perhaps many, their faith is a big part of their life. I don't judge them by the extremists. If they share about their dentistry, why not share a bit about them as a person also? I've seen some dentists do that, some will share that they are Christian also.

Doesn't offend me whatsoever that any dentist shares his faith on the website if he wishes. I like to see a bit about the person/dentist that I'm seeing. Dr Hesham also shares that he too has been mercury toxic and knows what it is like. That helps, as you realise you're seeing a dentist whose been up close and personal with the toxicity you are suffering.

He's not looking at it simply in a clinical way, he's been there.

Oh me too, Bex.

That's why I would exercise extreme caution when using the services of self-proclaimed devout muslim dentist unless I were also a muslim.

Al-taqiya (look it up) is the muslim practice of deceiving non-believers.

-------
Mr Hesham, the quran clearly states:


Slay the idolaters wherever you find them. 9:5

Don't bother to warn the disbelievers. Allah has blinded them. Theirs will be an awful doom. 2:6

Believers must fight for Allah. They must kill and be killed , and are bound to do so by the Torah, Gospel, and Quran. But Allah will reward them for it. 9:111


Kill disbelievers wherever you find them. If they attack you, then kill them. Such is the reward of disbelievers. (But if they desist in their unbelief, then don't kill them.) 2:191-2

Give tidings (O Muhammad) of a painful doom to the rich and greedy Christian monks and Jewish rabbis. 9:34

Those that the Muslims killed were not really killed by them. It was Allah who did the killing. 8:17

Surely the vilest of animals in Allah's sight are those who disbelieve (8:55)

O YOU WHO BELIEVE! DO NOT TAKE THE JEWS AND THE CHRISTIANS FOR FRIENDS; THEY ARE FRIENDS OF EACH OTHER; AND WHOEVER AMONGST YOU TAKES THEM FOR A FRIEND, THEN SURELY HE IS ONE OF THEM; SURELY ALLAH DOES NOT GUIDE THE UNJUST PEOPLE. (5:49-51)


Qur'an 2:86 "Their torment [the Jews] shall not be lightened nor shall they be helped."


5:33-“The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger, and strive with might and main for mischief through the land is: execution (by beheading), or crucifixion, or the cutting off of hands and feet from opposite sides, or exile from the land: that is their disgrace in this world, and a heavy punishment is theirs in the Hereafter;”

8:12- “I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off.”

47:4- “Therefore, when ye meet the Unbelievers (in fight), strike off their heads; at length; then when you have made wide Slaughter among them, carefully tie up the remaining captives”: thereafter (is the time for) either generosity or ransom: Until the war lays down its burdens.”

--------

I could go on and on and on... but there is certainly more information about islam on the internet than mercury poisoning so I will, most certainly assume, you are able to retrieve it yourself.

This is an interesting discussion but I think I have had enough. Anyone can do their own research on the teachings of the quran via the net.

Sosick, I have not looked into the Muslim teachings. That is certainly an eye opener and a concern! I just hope this thread doesn't end up a holy war.....

It will give new meaning to the word "cutting edge".

As usual, I have to agree with Bex, I prefer a doctor to believe in something, least aways then I know they aren't under the delusion that they themselves are God, common prollem with surgeons in particular.
The funny thing about religion is , if like me , you remember your past lives, all this counterproductive disagreement don't amount to much in God's eyes, the same energy is behind
the power of good, just clothed in different languages cultural nuance and of course political agenda, trust humans to screw it up.
I am not joking at all about remembering my past lives, If people knew more about this they would not be thinking suicide was an option, you only pick up where you left off.
Sorry, we are in for the long stint I'm afraid.Eternity could take forever, but heck, maybe we'll get something right with that amount of time( which is of course not what most people think it is)
Courage mes amis!

Sosick,

Extremism is present in all religions. You can get similar fire and brimstone qoutes and stories from the bible. I have travelled and know both Muslisms and Jews who can be extreme or moderate and anything in between. Your view that all Muslims are extreme in the way that you say they are is untrue and therefore prejudice. This is likely to increase racial and religious intolerance and hatred rather than working towards a more positve outcome

Anonymous, this used to be a positive forum where people would try and share good information to help one another. I haven’t had my money back from hesham because I recovered from mercury poisoning – have you? If so, perhaps you’d like to share your story with everybody and, if not, maybe you should open your mind a bit more and not be so judgmental. I’d also be quite interested to know what you think the procedure for removing mercury from a tooth should be? It’s my understanding that there are various methods and protocols for this and it is up to the patient to decide which works for them best. Informed consent I think it’s called.

Elvis, you’re right there’s more than one way to skin a cat!….and it’s better if people speak from their own experiences and knowledge. It’s a bit too easy for some people to sit there and made cynical comments even though I appreciate this in itself could be the symptom of a mercury toxic person!!

So sick – how dare you question how Hesham would treat a Jewish patient, that is actually an unbelievable thing to say and I hope you’re ashamed. I actually can’t believe what you’ve written.

Oh, and I found this about Avicenna (as he’s called in the west) otherwise known as ibn sinna…….

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avicenna

thank you,Ray Gee, Richard ,I can shut up now.

Okay, I agree that this used to be a positive forum, however it started to turn south way before sosick became a memeber of this forum. Perhaps we are ALL showing our mercury symptoms here, being cynical, that is. It's amazing to me that some only come on to post when it's about Hersham or if they can down another dentist.

We are here to build one another up. Russ has asked more than once for us to try to be careful in how we post to one another. As the creator of this forum, he has the right to do this.

I think it's good to be honest about a dentist on here, because this is the only way we can warn eachother or share a good testimony. Where else will we get honest answers?

IT should not have to be covered up if there are concerning or blatantly concerning elements. If that happens that we are doing a disservice to others by knowing negative testimonies/reports and keeping them silent. It is a fine line between alerting others, but being careful how we do it and making sure the alerts are genuine and enough to warrant some kind of tactful exposure.

Dr Hesham for the most part on here has had favourable testimonies, I do not believe he has a thing to worry about and he has always defended his position. But there are certain dentists out there that have a very bad ongoing track records, one that may have harmed many patients and to hide that and allow others to be sucked into going is to my mind almost a crime.

These forums are actually the few places one can rely on getting mostly honest and straight answers from fellow sufferers. Admittedly, it should not be abused or used as a way of deliberately stirring trouble and taking personal and unnecessary pot shots at a dentist, but if there are enough negative outcomes, then we have a duty to get the word out somehow.

But making sure it's done in a careful manner so it does not start a big flame war and puts Russ' forum at risk in the process, which happened in the past. If you see someone ask about a dentist and you KNOW for sure that dentist has totally messed you up and/or others, and you are being fair about your criticism, getting your facts straight, then it would be kind and wise to smiply state your brief concern and possibly email the person off the forum to give more detail on that.

That's just my view. Perhaps just stating "I did not have a good experience with this dentist and have a few concerns. I can email you in more detail if you like". Of course, if someone has a good testimony, then they are free to state it in detail with no risk.

Dr Hesham has his own method of doing mercury removals and other dentists have theirs. And that's what this thread is about. Which method sounds a good bet, and where do you want to place your trust? It's good people are sharing what their dentist does or what they found helped them.

>>P.S Does this mean that Dr. Wesley Shankland should not talk about his christian beliefs on his dental website?

Dr Wesley and Hesham may do whatever they please in a free society, within lawful and ethical limits. But I also do hope Dr Wesley believes in the Christian words and ideas he posts just as strongly as Mr Hesham believes in the words of his quran, especially as regards the patients that put their trust in him as a self-proclaimed Christian dentist.

If however, his Christian beliefs are just decorating his website, but he doesn't really abide by those ideas/beliefs in his life, then of course, I would worry that he was dishonest in other ways as well.. For instance, if he is just using the bible to attract Christian clients but doesn't really believe the bible... well my next thought would be that... maybe he is just faking his role as a caring dentist also. Kind of deceitful to use the bible to simply prop oneself up and a real Christian will always discern that...

I really think you could put your speculative paranoia to much better use questioning whether or not we actually do live in a free society. I don't think we have much to worry about re Dr.s Shankland / El-Essawy
Anaways, at least you seem to put some faith in a REAL (?)
Christians power of discernment...
Amazing...

I'm logged in but not showing up, better check a mirror
Elvis
oh, okay there I am, that was me above just so you don't confuse me with anonamii

From Dr Hesham El-Essawy


About the appalling postings of SoSick, I would not normally respond to such ignorant/abusive insults and false claims, simply because the Quran commands me to do so. The Qur’an says, “Forgive those who oppress you, give to those who denied you, connect your bridges to those who broke their bridges with you, and do not betray those who betrayed you!”

The website is my personal website; it is about what I believe in, not just about a business that I am promoting. It is not at all mandatory for anyone to log onto it, particularly if he is so sick or so confused that he is liable to misconstrue or misunderstand what it is all about.

I have thought long and hard about removing the Islamic content from the website and into another for 'the Islamic Society for the promotion of religious Tolerance', which I am honoured by being its chairman. One thing happened that made me change my mind; I discovered that some patients when they recover from their physical ills they discover that they have many spiritual ones, and for some, it was unbearable. Those particular persons do appreciate the Islamic content on the website as it helps them to realise that there is a purpose to life after all and that it all makes sense.

The website that angered SoSick so revoltingly has actually helped so many to realise the spiritual side of their existence. Never did I impose my beliefs on anyone nor will I ever do that. I believe that Islam is a religion for the intelligent and as experience has shown in the west in particular, Islam is growing at a rate of 220% and most of the converts are from what I call the ‘Intelligencia’. I say that in a partial answer to SoSick, for had it been as he claimed, this would not have happened.

Less that half of the people in the world believe in One God who created all, and any one who believes in One God who created and sustains all is by definition a Muslim. All the prophets of the bible as well as the Quran are messengers of the same One God. believe in one and all or believe in none at all. No one can be a true Jew or a true Christian without being also a true Muslim. To God there are only two religions; belief and unbelief. God gave humankind the freedom of choice and every person, SoSick included, is free to believe or disbelieve, and a freedom given by God no man can take away.

My Islamic beliefs also compel me to look after my patients in the best possible way. “God loves that when you do a job, you do it properly”. In fact, my Islamic beliefs are the best possible protection for my patient from me, for I am constantly fearful from offending God by doing a less than perfect job, which the patient will never know about but God will.

SoSick has come up with many false claims and accusations on this forum. I tried to enlighten him a little but in vain. Some people are like that. I wish him better as he does not seem to me to be a very happy person.

Dr. Heshamstein,

I believe in God, the Father almighty, creator of heaven and earth.
I believe in Jesus Christ, his only Son, our Lord.

He was conceived by the power of the Holy Spirit and born of the Virgin Mary.
He suffered under Pontius Pilate,
was crucified, died, and was buried.
He descended to the dead.
On the third day he rose again.
He ascended into heaven,
and is seated at the right hand of the Father.
He will come again to judge the living and the dead.

I believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy catholic Church, the communion of saints, the forgiveness of sins, the resurrection of the body, and the life everlasting.


I believe in Jesus Christ, the Son of the Living God. I do not believe in Mohammed. If my Lord had intended me to abandon Christ and follow Mohammed, he would have told me to do so. He has not. In fact, he has told me to beware of false prophets.

I am a Christian and refuse to be categorized BY a Muslim as a Muslim.

I believe in the Holy Trinity as mentioned above -- God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. Mohammed is never mentioned in my creed, my prayers and my faith and never will be.

I am not a Muslim. Not even by default. Hesham's presumptuous and erroneous rationalizations attempt to group me, a Christian, with Islam.. To say that the logic Hesham is using is flawed an ignorant would be the understatement of the year.

'Nuff said.

Yours in Christ (not Mohammed) +

How can a post about the use or non use of a rubber dam turn into this slanging match?
I am disgusted, and everyone involved in this thread, So Sick and Hesham included, have gone down greatly in my estimation.
If Hesham had any confidence in his own abilities, he would refrain from contributing.
Also, So Sick is on the wrong forum - is there one called www.imsoangry.com?

I try to be tolerant of disagreements and disputes among people for through these disputes, much information is brought to light. I only ask that people disagree and dispute kindly. (I haven't seen anything nasty recently, only heated, so I have no problem with that).

I do respect people who are passionate about something, whether right or wrong, they care, and that's the most important starting place. Once someone cares, with continued study, they will (hopefully) eventually find the truth and live/teach/dispute more accurately with age.

So, let us not be too disgusted with those who dispute about things they are passionate about. At least they are passionate.

Also, let us not worry about the change in subject matter on threads. A forum system like this accommodates changing subjects in the course of a conversation just as in-person conversations do. So if people want to talk about something different as a conversation migrates, that's fine.

The (almost) only thing I ask is kindness toward one another. That way we can disagree all we want and through the exchange of words we will all probably learn something useful. We cannot learn/grow/explore new ideas through disrespectful speech.

Religion is an important subject and I respect when people have strong feelings about it so I don't discourage conversations about it. When the times comes that people do stop feeling strongly about important subjects as this is the time I begin to get worried.

Thanks for your ear.

Your Moderator, Russ

From Hesham El-Essawy.


Oops!
I forgot to tell you, SoSick that I am a scholar of the bible too. In fact I just started on a book called “El-Essawy’s Biography of Jesus”. If you wish me to give you some input, please read on, otherwise, please turn away.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++



Allow me to look critically at what you have written here and discuss it scholarly. I will write my comments preceded with a litle dash underneath your comments, which I placed between quotation marks.


“I believe in God, the Father almighty, creator of heaven and earth.”

-So do I, and that is what makes me a Muslim.

“I believe in Jesus Christ, his only Son, our Lord.”

-I believe that Jesus was a most honourable messenger of God, he said so, and that also makes me a Muslim. But let me ask you, did Jesus create the universe? If he did not, which is obvious as he himself was created as you say, then he could not have been the Father, the first. And if the Father was not a father before He had a son (which is obvious) then The Father has changed His condition, and true God is eternal, and that means that he does not change.

"He was conceived by the power of the Holy Spirit and born of the Virgin Mary."

-I believe in that too, the holy ghost is the archangel Gabriel and Mary was a virgin when she gave birth to Jesus, and he,Jesus spoke to his family immediately after birth to announce himself and to defend his mother from the obvious allegations.

"He suffered under Pontius Pilate,
was crucified, died, and was buried."

-I believe that he did not die at all. how can you say that Jesus was God the Almighty then say that he died on the cross? the almighty who dies is not an almighty. and if you are saying that Jesus was not the Almighty, then, here you are, you said it!

"He descended to the dead.
On the third day he rose again."

-count from friday evening to sunday morning sir, they are only two nights and a day! obvious, is it not?

"He ascended into heaven"

-yes he did.

"and is seated at the right hand of the Father"

-but if Jesus was God who came down to earth to die for man's sins, should you not expect him to sit on the throne itself, not on the right side of God!

"He will come again to judge the living and the dead."

-we had a few false alarms did we not!

“I believe in the Holy Spirit”

-do you know what that is? The church does not seem to agree on that!

“, the holy Catholic Church, the communion of saints,”

-and what will these do for you if GodWho is sitting on the throne decides to put you in hellfire? Nothing of course!

“The forgiveness of sins,”

-I believe in that too, but not in any one carying the sins of any other. God does not need to die for our sins, it is much less painful to forgive them while sitting on the throne. all you need to do is to open your heart and speak sincerely to God whose name is Eli, Elohim, Allah, and say, “I am sorry!” and He will forgive you instantly. You see, God loves to forgive, that is why He also calls Himself, ‘The Compassionate, The Merciful’.

“The resurrection of the body, and the life everlasting.”

-I believe in that too, on the day of judgemjent.


“I believe in Jesus Christ, the Son of the Living God”

-you mean a god who died is the son of a living one!

-actually the Greek word which was translated to ‘son’ does not mean son at all, it means ‘servant’.

-Jesus never claimed to be God, always that he was sent by God. He said in John 14:28, and I quote, “for my father is greater than I.” Had he been God or the son of God he would not have said that. Furthermore, Jesus said quite plainly that the Father is ‘The only true God’, not the son and not the Holy Ghost.


“. I do not believe in Mohammed.”

-why not? He came with the same message. Furthermore, he is the one about whom the scriptures foretold. He is the one about whom Jesus spoke in John 14:16, 14:25-26, 14:30-31, 15:26, 16:7-8, 16:13. As well as telling us about Muhammad in various places, he is actually mentioned in the bible by name in Isaiah.

"If my Lord had intended me to abandon Christ and follow Mohammed, he would have told me to do so. He has not. In fact, he has told me to beware of false prophets.

-Actually, you were told by Jesus, again in John 16:13, “Howbeit when he, the spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will show you things to come.”

-of course you will object to what I am saying by protesting that Jesus was speaking of the holy ghost when he said that, as falsely inserted much later on into John 14:26, I will draw your attention to John 14:30, in which Jesus said that the one to come, the comforter, has ‘nothing in me’, so, according to your Trinitarian doctrine, he was not the holy ghost, was he?

“I am a Christian and refuse to be categorized BY a Muslim as a Muslim. “

-that is your right of course, but many Christians do not share the beliefs that you described, and rather believe in One God like I do, not three gods like you do.

“I believe in the Holy Trinity as mentioned above -- God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. Mohammed is never mentioned in my creed, my prayers and my faith and never will be. “

-You are so right, you are not a Muslim, and do not worry yourself too much, I do not call you a Muslim! your faith has its roots in the age old 'Mystery Religions', look it up sir, google it if you wish!

“I am not a Muslim. Not even by default. Hesham's presumptuous and erroneous rationalizations attempt to group me, a Christian, with Islam.. To say that the logic Hesham is using is flawed an ignorant would be the understatement of the year.
'Nuff said.”

-please do not upset yourself too much. You beliefs are your own. And remember that you were under no obligations whatsoever to read what I wrote here.

Yours in Christ (not Mohammed) +

- Actually, my name, el-essawy, means “the follower of Jesus”. the real name of Jesus is Essa.

Anyway, may I say to you in conclusion, SoSick, even though you hate me so much and for nothing other than being a Muslim; Peace be upon you!

Hesham.

P.s.I have a lot more to say, but ‘NUFF’ for now!

Dr Hesham, with all due respect, All Christians believe in one God, but three persons/parts within One God. All Christians believe in God the Father (creator), God the Son (redeemer in the flesh) and God the holy spirit (the unseen power of God). There is only ONE God. Take for example an apple and split the apple up into thirds, the apple is the same apple, but three parts of that apple make up one apple. THe holy trinity is a mystery to us, we accept it by faith. Jesus to us is God. In God, of God, is God. All are one, father, Son and Holy Spirit.

I could be on this thread and defend my faith till the cows come home but I wonder what that would achieve here?

The Christian faith goes back over 2000 years. Christ to us is not merely a "prophet", He is God. People to this day heal in the name of Jesus, miracles have never ceased since the time Christ walked the earth.

Many people on this forum are Christians or they are from another faith. But each of those who have a spiritual belief lean on their faith to help get them through the torment of mercury and or other illness. I believe that those who believe in God, all believe in the same God (one creator). However, we differ greatly in our view of WHO the person of God really is. I believe it is Jesus, you believe it is Mohammad.

Perhaps we could agree to disagree and let this thread go back to its original intention? which is protection during amalgam removal. I am sure this is the direction that Russ and the rest would wish this subject to go back to.

No offense and I admire your strong faith and respect that. I do hope you respect mine also. But on this forum? we have to be aware of where these types of debates/disagreements will lead to. There are forums for that alone, or there is email if people wish to take it further.

Thanks Hesham, but it wasn't I who posted the Apostle's creed above.

And as Bex said, we really aren't here to argue religion. Your proclamations of your muslim faith are a matter of interest but not the type of thing I need a dentist for.

No need to feel sorry for me either. I am quite blessed in this life, albeit only temporarily suffering from the ignorance and lack of education of those in the dental 'profession'. Though it has been quite a learning experience and I doubt without reason. I am angry at dentists yes, seems everyone here is angry at dentists, and with good reason.

Have a great day, may God bless you and lead you to truth.

ps - the real name of Jesus is Yeshua, Yeshua HaMashiach.

There are some very knowledgeable people on this forum.

From Hesham El-Essawy.

Back to the main subject matter of this thread.

This thread started by a question from James; Rubber dam, Quadrant order, oxygen supply really necessary now? Hesham’s protocol doesn’t use them? NEED ADVICE PLEASE!!!


Here is my advice and my needed clarifications:

For the mercury toxic patient, the most important part of the treatment is the careful and complete removal of ALL amalgam and ALL mercury from teeth WITHOUT letting the patient inhale or swallow any of it.

To do that, I build barriers between the teeth and the throat. We discovered 17 years ago when I started on this that the rubber dam does not stop mercury and powdered amalgam from escaping from around the tooth and into the mouth. Initially, when I read the mercury level in the mouth after removing the rubber dam I was horrified to notice a very high reading of mercury, and I remember at that time feeling bemused as to what may have caused that high level. The rubber dam simply cannot do it, and the reader of this should not assume that doing the work without a rubber dam means that we do not protect the patient some other way. The pictures as I said before are on my website for all to see. It is not a secret.

To do the above, I use sedation in order to help the patient to tolerate the barriers that I build in his mouth. If for any reason I cannot seal the side I am working on from the throat, I simply abort the procedure.

I put oxygen tubes in the patient nose and cover the nose and the eyes with a gold mask that prevents mercury vapour from entering.

I remove the amalgam completely without any particular order from one side then read every tooth with the mercury vapour analyzer. It usually gives a mercury reading, big or small.

I then proceed to detox every tooth with my herbal detox called environ, read the tooth again, detox again and again until the tooth reads zero mercury.

I then proceed to do the other side, then I place temporary fillings that are to be kept for the entire period the patient is detoxing his mercury load from the body.

I see the patient on the following day if he can, and the patient usually report that he or she is feeling better. It seems that as soon as the body senses that the threat of the amalgam is out it cannot wait to start getting rid of its mercury load in the internal organs.

Let me say this; if you had amalgam removed and did not get better immediately or soon after, this means that there is still mercury under your fillings. We see an increasing number of patients with that problem and we do help them through following the same procedure above.

I have found no need at all to using or doing anything else.

Best wishes to all.

Hesham el-essawy
www.el-essawy.com
hesham@el-essawy.com


p.s. I do not know how I feel about being drawn into a religious discussion on this forum. I did not mean or seek to upset the sensibilities of any one, hear that Bex! If I did offend anyone, I am sorry. By the way Bex, Muhammad is neither God, nor the son of God; he is the messenger of God who was proclaimed in the bible.

What I was tying to say really is this; it is vitally important for a person to examine his faith critically and not to swallow ideas whole without subjecting them to reason. If you are a Christian, why not go back to the bible and study what Jesus said rather than believe without examination what others have said about him? For that end, I used only quotations from the Gospels, not the Quran.

I do respect fully the right of the other to have views or beliefs different from mine, and that that difference makes absolutely no difference to our duties towards each other as brothers in a common humanity. A person’s beliefs are personal and are between him and His God. It is the way we behave towards each other that matters for us in this world.

Finally, Russ, from what I read of your comments so far, your views on tolerance mirror mine.

DR Hesham, I am not aquainted enough with your faith, and I apologise for getting that wrong! After I typed that about Muhammad, as "God", I had a feeling I was wrong and did indeed think "Prophet OF God" . I should have corrected that immediately. So am a bit embarrassed to say the least, thanks for the correction. I agree with your points regarding ones behaviour towards their fellow man. Definitely!

Just glad the thread is heading back to the original post.

WOW, if I hadn't already been to you I'd want to now, Dr. El -Essawy,and if my memory wasn't as bad as it was, I'd prolly be trying to make an appointment tomorrow.
Sometimes it just seems like ya gotta dig in the dirt to come up with the truffles. (prolly bad for candida, though, right Bex?)
My beliefs are to wish everyone here much light, love and healing, whether or not I share their faith.
I got a bit riled but as much as I don't like someone steppin on my azure nubucks, I really don't like someone steppin on another persons sky blue crocs, especially when I know that is a person of high integrity.
Blessings to all, we need it.

It's my understanding that dentists doing mercury removal use a rubber dam, suction and a water spray, the water spray being necessary perhaps to settle the mercury but also to cool the tooth as it drilled because high speed drills can cause the tooth to get extremely hot, which, without the cooling water spary, can easily kill the tooth by damaging the nerve.

Any particular reason gold (opaque/nonot seet-hrough?) eye shades are used in preference to transparent plastic eye protection/goggles? Lots of people with mercury problems are also quite sensitive to 'gold', aka, jewelry quality gold mixed with other metals such as nickel.

For the record, my dentist did not use a rubber dam, but the Clean-Up suction device, which is supposed to reduce mercury vapour by 100%, plenty of water, and a gold mask over my eyes and nose. He maintained that the rubber dam would not stop tiny bits of mercury slipping down the side.

Best
Nicola

I haven't been on this forum for a while as I've not been well so it wasn't until today I read what has been going on!

I am disgusted at the racial comments which have appeared on this forum. To bring someone's race, colour, creed or anything else which makes a person different in the eyes of another into a conversation/discussion is downright disgusting! It doesn't matter what a person is, whether they are black, white, Jewish Catholic, Muslim, gay, straight, bi...WE ARE ALL HUMAN BEINGS LIVING ON THE SAME PLANET!!! We are all the same..we all bleed red blood...we are ALL HUMAN BEINGS! And, before anyone asks, I am a Catholic, and have been since 1988. I was born Jewish but did not follow the faith, as I believed in Jesus since a small child, someone which I'm sure most of you know Jews do not believe in. I have my own religious beliefs which take in Catholicism religion-wise and the Jewish culture. Being Jewish is not just a religion, it is a culture...a way of life. A person can change religions..leave the Jewish religion behind but they cannot leave the culture...it is bred into them and very hard to let go of no matter how they try. So..I don't share the same religious beliefs to Hesham!

Why shouldn't Hesham contribute to this forum? He has a right to defend himself against the lies and rubbish which is posted about him!

So what if Hesham doesn't follow Hal Huggins' protocol? OK...Hal has a brilliant protocol...I've met the man and had a great conversation with him...but that doesn't mean to say that his protocol is the be all and end all..there are other protocols just as good, if not better than Hal's. Hesham's protocol is a very good one, as those who have got their lives back thanks to him can tell you.

Good on you JoeUK for not listening to the vicious, rude and unbelievable comments some of the people on this forum have made, and deciding to still go to Hesham for your removal!

SoSick: What business is it of yours if Hesham wishes to use his website for something other than dentistry? He has a love of his religion..why shouldn't he write about it on his OWN website? I have more than amalgam on my own site. OK..so now I'll probably be a target for vicious statements about the content of my site. But the point I'm making is..it's Hesham's website, he can choose what content he wishes to publish on it. He is a brilliant dentist..he loves his religion...the two don't intermingle. Of course he treats Jews, Christians...anyone....he doesn't ask for documentation as to what religion a prospective patient is!

And, as for calling Hesham a 'quack'...that is most definitely wrong! lol lol Do you know what the real definition of a quack is? Where it came from? I guess not. In 1840 when American dentists formed the American Society of Dental surgeons, the members were required to sign a pledge that they would NOT use mercury in their fillings. Dentists who were found to be using mercury were fined for malpractice. Mercury was known as 'quicksilver' in America but in Europe it was known as 'quacksalver'. Quacksalver was used as a cure for skin diseases, especially the lesions associated with syphilis. The lesions would disappear but the disease and the quacksalver went deeper into the organs and nervous system and the person died a very painful death. The 'doctors' soon beame known as 'quacks' because they were using the 'quacksalver'....a poisonous substance to 'cure'. The term was then used to describe a dentist who used 'quacksalver' for the same purpose, to 'cure' or fix a decayed tooth with amalgam. Hesham's dental practice is completely mercury-free...so he is most definitely NOT a quack! lol lol

Those who have brought the subject of religion into this discussion have really lowered themselves...lower than they can ever get, in my estimation...and it is very sad.

I can't believe how, from one woman's posting where she slandered Hesham's name, (and yes, I know she apologised for this), it has now come down to him being racially abused on this forum. It's disgusting!!!

Russ, I would certainly think about removing the posts which are racist before you are asked to do so. This is a great website you have here..you don't want to have it classed as racist.

I know the poem below is not about religion, but it may make some of you think.

Lyn Rennick
www.LynRennicksAMPSsociety.co.uk
Lyn@LynRennicksAMPSsociety.co.uk


SOWING SEEDS IN INNOCENTS


<img src="http://www.members.aol.com/lynrennick2000/seeds.jpg">

Black or white, coffee or cream,
Skin is skin, even if it's green,
What's on the inside makes the man,
Ignore the colour if you can.

<img src="http://www.members.aol.com/lynrennick2000/BandWhands.jpg">

Underneath the flesh we are all the same,
We were put on this earth to play life's game,
Some try to change that game into war,
But that's not what we were intended for.

<img src="http://www.members.aol.com/lynrennick2000/Nowarsmall3.gif">

Ignorance is bliss, or so they say,
But to be on the receipt of such, is a high price to pay
Black on the left, white on the right?
Colourblindness should be part of our sight.

<img src="http://www.members.aol.com/lynrennick2000/BWkids2.jpg">

Innocent children don't see colour in skin,
For prejudice is something that's not born from within,
It's taught to them by misleading adults,
Whose mindless teachings lead to appauling results.

<img src="http://www.members.aol.com/lynrennick2000/colourbabies2.jpg">

The colourful friends they had when they were young
They now speak to only with a bitter tongue
The innocent turn ignorant, then they teach their own
And once more the seeds of prejudice are sown.

<img src="http://www.members.aol.com/lynrennick2000/mansowing2.gif">


We are all God's children, no man is better than another because of his colour, religion, creed, sexual preference or disablement...we are brothers and sisters on the earth and should love others for what they are inside.

Lyn Rennick (1988)©

I don't recall ever discussing race here, though I have been called racist for questioning religion, and find it rather odd.

Maybe you want to discern race from religion, since muslims, hindus, christians, whatever, are not defined by race or ancestry. You are obviously an example of that Lynn.

Hesham's website is more about Islam than dentistry and that is what led to this strange discussion.

Personally, I don't agree with you in regard to accepting all people at face value either. An inquiring miind inquires, an intelligent person looks before they leap. Asking questions and raising objections is not sinful. Though the history of 'dentistry' and 'medicine' may be.

Why so many people regard asking questions about the quran and it's anti-semitic/anti-christian bantering to be racist is also a very good question. Perhaps there is a flaw in your education. Learning to accept every thought and idea that presents itself does make you very manageable, but it won't make you healthy and happy, it will not help you succeed nor will it ever make everyone love you in return. Even Hesham accused me of hating him... where he got that idea I really don't know. Perhaps he is projecting something of his own is all I can suggest.

Nice try though, Lynn.

I was wondering, if Hesham uses a water spray, like I suppose he needs to, but doesn't use a rubber dam or similar, then what keeps the water (mixed with bits of amalgam/mercury) from going down the patient's throat? A little bit of cheesecloth or guaze won't stop mercury.

I'd prefer transparent plastic goggles so I can see my surroundings. I get claustrophobic when confined for too long.

Y'all worry too much sosick about all that as I'm sure ya have no intention a goin to Dr. E-E. I'm just sad cuz I thought the gold mask was a VIP kinda thing just for me!
In England we got a different kinda awareness a cultural/racist issues, its plain ol less tolerated here. , Thank God, whoever that is for ya.
( pay no notice to condescending remarks Lyn,ya sound pretty sincere to me)

Thank you Elvis. Don't worry, I won't listen to SoSick...I never pay attention to ignorant, racist people, especially when they have no idea what they are talking about. It's very sad when someone doesn't even recognise the fact that they are being racist.

"An inquiring mind inquires, an intelligent person looks before they leap." Yes, very true SoSick, but an intelligent person would also see that it doesn't matter what race, religion, creed etc. a person is..they would accept all people. And, BTW, there is no flaw in my education. I had a brilliant education and upbringing which is why I know that we should accept all people because we are all the same underneath our colour or religious views.

Lyn
www.LynRennicksAMPSsociety.co.uk
Lyn@LynRennicksAMPSsociety.co.uk

Lynn
Could you not have held back on that post for the sake of this thread now that it was FINALLY and OBVIOUSLY heading in a better direction? This just totally contradicts the nature of your post. you are basically attempting to provoke a flame war. You have shown total intolerance of people daring to question someone faith or methods if they find them a threat. Yes, admittedly, the manner it was done could have been more respectful , and that I can undrstand you criticising, but going this far?

To me you are behaving like a drama queen and blowing this as far out of proportion as humanly possible. People on here for the most part are very accepting and courageous and not afraid to bring up a matter that could be a threat to them. You are intolerant of this it would seem, yet here you preach tolerance...??? How does this work Lynn?

NObody is putting down someone' else's faith on here, BUT if the faith preaches some very concerning stuff that could be a threat to that person's health or life, is it any wonder it was brought up?

Your statements are right, we shoud never judge someone unfairly based on color, creed, etc. But if that person's faith is a threat to us physically, becuase we believe otherwise....then YEAH it should be brought up and this you cannot seem to "tolerate".

I have seen you do this on another thread. Just when it was calming down, and in actual fact had ENDED after much painful discussions and attempts at others to finally get it to stop, you started it right back up again on another thread. You even went so far as to state the person's name and experience, even though the person had asked explicity, please leave me out of future discussions re Dr Hesham. You DELIBERATELY brought hte matter back up when you could have easily avoided this or been far more senstiive and tactful. Again, you did not take into consideration their feelings at all, but blindly defended Dr Heham at all costs. Part of your previous defense has been fair and justified, but you seem to have gone past that point and now it's bordering on simply provoking problems, rather than settling them.

Please stop flaming Lynn and allow this thread to once again try and get back to the topic at hand. Russ and others did a good enough job at getting it back where it was and Russ has preached the nonjudgemental manner in which we should conduct ourselves. Why did you feel the need to bring it back up and blow it back up?

I guess what I think is sad (and yes, I do have an opinion, but will spare everyone from hearing it), is that I am looking at 3 posts beneath this one where people have genuine questions about mercury poisoning and one has two answers, one has three, and one has five. There is one post that is two beneath the one with five where someone inadvertantly chelated with amalgam in and is having a reaction to thimerisol with 0 answers (I would answer it, but don't know the answer to his question. I know that some who have posted have a lot of knowledge about mercury poisoning. So why??? Why not answer these people. It's sad. (Not meant to step on anyones toes, please don't give any energy to this post)

Hi anon,. I just answered that very post your speaking of myself after making my way through all these threads. Why did you say this? In fact this thread here has been one of the last I looked at. I've had to check my emails, check other forums I belong to, then checked this one and made my way through the renewed threads. We dont have all the answers as you have admitted and it takes time to read each thread too, after doing other things.

I have only just got onto this one myself. Good luck to people who can read and answer all threads at once!!! I feel your comments were a bit premature and a little judgemental to be honest. I realise your concern though, but give people a chance. I haven't even been awake. I'm in New Zealand on the other side of the world and others are in England, USA, all different times.

I certainly didn't mean it the way it was taken, Bex, I appologize.

No worries anon! I know you were well meaning. It's too easy to give too much energy to certain threads and forget other ones, which is what you were getting at.

I happen to agree with most of Lyn's earlier post with the pics . I dont personally know if she was trying to start a flame war. I liked much of what she said.
Lyn i think the reason the religion side was brought up was only due to some of the teachings that may make those outside of the islamic faith possibly feel unnerved and insecure. If you feel you are the enemy to a muslim dentist because of what his faith teaches, its not a secure feeling. Dr Hesham defended and explained himself well though. I thought it had been resolved...
And yeah Lyn, Dr Hal Huggins way is not the only way to do amalgam removal! I see Dr Hesham does have a way of protecting the mouth and throat, but not the classic rubber dam. Whatever way hes seen that has been the most effective is what he uses. Hes been in this business for years. Im sure hes found a way that is as good as he can get it.

I dont believe that all patients improve from amalgam removal though even with everyting done perfectly. We have seen that on this forum and some are still suffering after it.

Questioning is healthy, but its the manner in which we make our statements sometimes that really cause problems. I think Dr Hesham tends to be targeted on here too sometimes because he's a dentist. We've been harmed by past dentists guess no suprise many of us are now cynical and not overly trusting?

>We've been harmed by past dentists guess no suprise many of us are now cynical and not overly trusting?

Voila! Problem is, this dentist asserts himself as an authority in dentistry as well as other things, and he has already in this thread made misleading statements in regard to other things which I can easily judge, though my knowledge of the fine points of dentistry may not be as apt. None the less, since he makes misleading statements about one thing (eg; Jesus' real name is... eg; quran does not direct killing of jews/christians etc) I do think it's actually reasonable to question his actual knowledge in other areas he claims to be an authority in also.

Plus he does root canals which also suggests that this is not truly a health conscious individual.

Lynn's photos are nice, but I don't generally equate a person's skin color with their religious beliefs. I guess I am somewhat lost trying to understand why she seems to assert that muslims do not believe the quran or take it to heart the same way christians or buddhists believe their own teachings. From my truly extensive experience among people of different faiths, I have found exactly the opposite to be true. People usually use their faith as a base to give meaning to their lives and to provide fundamental ethical and moral direction.

Lyn, Lyn, Lyn,

What shall I do?

First: The activity on this thread had calmed to 1 post per day and now we suddenly we have a reignited flame. Do you know why?


Second, you said this:





I want to refer you to this post, which—in the end—is about acting kind and humbly toward one another because of our interdependency:

Kind & Humble

The reason this is so important is because actions simply speak louder than words.

You have a lot to say about racism, and that's fine, but we must not forget that there is a lot more that causes division among people than the color of their skin, such as anger, accusation, presumption, and many other things.

If you want to be an advocate to end division among people, great, but if at the same time you are causing division of another kind, your effectiveness will be lost.


You said...



Now, contrary to popular "political-correctness", the belief system that someone holds affects every area of their life. Even if they don't believe in God—especially if they don't believe in God—it intimately affects, colors, even defines our decisions in life.

It is only wise to know if your mechanic, for example, has any sense of accountability when no one is looking. It is only prudent to know what your computer repair person believes because if he does not care about honesty (for example) which is directly associated with his belief system, i.e., his "religion", your computer may not receive the good work it deserves.

Now, in relation to speaking out, I respect your rights to speak out about this subject and I don't intend on removing your post, however, you should exercise your rights without wishing to extinguish the rights of others (removing posts). If you don't respect this principle, you will become the very tyrant you claim to abhor.

Now, about removing posts.


You said...





Removing posts?

Do you believe the best way to stop cancer is to cover it up—forget it—try to believe it does not exist?

In my opinion, if someone makes a racist remark, especially on a public forum, they are taking responsibility for the remark. This gives others who view the remark the ability (freedom) to make their own judgments about the character of the one who made the remark.

To remove the remark would be like trying to pretend it never happened, and thus I would remove the ability for people who would have otherwise viewed it from being able to form their own opinions about the person who made it. In short, I would be protecting the person who made it from having to take responsibility for their own statements.

I don't believe covering up racism is a solution any more than pretending there is no cancer will help us deal with the real problem. I also don't believe racist remarks influence others to change their minds about these issues, therefore, no harm is done by leaving the post online. Almost all people have preexisting opinions about racism that won't be swayed one way or the other by remarks on a forum. Only their opinion towards the person making the remark is affected, and that is as it should be.

I would also carefully review the remarks and see if they are racist at all. If the remarks you are referring to are about a religious belief towards a race of people, it is not the race that is being slandered, it is the religion. Of course, the word "slandered" only applies if what was said about the religion is not true. I personally don't know because I don't study that religion, although I'd like to know if it is true or not.

If they are true, good; Now I know and the truth is brought to light. If not, they should be properly rebutted. In either case, there is no reason to keep the truth secret.

Lyn,

You have a lot to say about "love" on your website. Let's make sure you are as effective as you can be in spreading this message by demonstrating it, whether in person, or online.


Finally, you said...



(emphasis mine)

And you sent this to your mailing list group.

Lyn,

I know that you know that racism is a generalization about people, and this type of generalism is regarded as harmful among those who hate racism, like yourself.

Unfortunately, these kinds of statements that you make (above) are no different. In this case, you are generalizing our entire forum for the actions of a few, and then, without discernment.

Instead of making these types of generalisms, let us try to be honest, telling the whole story, and most of all, let's not cause division between us. We are all working for the same cause and for the same purpose (to help people) and division will only make our cause weaker.

I've been aware of these comments for some time, but thought that, only in this circumstance, was it more-than-correct to point this out to you.

Again, let's work together to get better at working together. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Russ,
Your Moderator

thanx russ for sharing that. It is outrageous and upsetting. The time and effort people put on this forum to help others has been going on for years and this forum is one of the most active ones I have been on.

I have not come across such help and continued responses to questions on any forum as I have here. People here seem to be allowed to be open and share and the price to pay for that sometimes is things can get out of hand.

Lynn has decided to take umbridge over a thread that got out of control. She takes no notice of the other threads or the usual wonderful help given and great people on here everyday. She's hell bent on focussing on that one thread and behaving like the innocent.

She had people defend her, yet she wanted instead to focus on the few unkind retaliations she got. Oddly enough, when it calmed down and things got back to normal, she fired it back up on another thread. She knew exactly what it would lead to and went about it in a rather cold manner.

Now once she did that and the forseen occured, she speaks against the entire forum. The only time I see her here is when Dr Hesham is mentioned and she's on like a shot.

This pretty much describes her role on this forum. I've not seen any real positives out of her, other than trolling and one can add defaming to that also. Putting down an entire forum based on a couple of threads that she was involved in. Bravo.

I have to say im surprised !!!!. Ironically Lyn's statements are contradicted by so many who actually think this forum is a stand out for some of the kindest people they have met <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />. I have to say I recommend this forum at every opportunity over any other.
Very sad to hear Lyn is doing this. I dont base my judgements on the few threads that may have gotten unpleasant/heated. I see far too much good on here and aid and good people. Not bitter, nasty or hateful as Lyn describes or would have people believe. But people, who even in their sickness give advice or words of encouragement and care to others.

I guess one tries to see the good in people and give them the benefit of the doubt, but sadly this says it all. Not impressed. Here's hoping that her bad publicity may backfire and through curiosity some may venture on here and find instead some suprisingly giving and genuine people suffering just like themselves.
To me this behaviour is unkind, untrue and does a great disservice to the many on here who tirelessly give of themselves on a daily basis. Lyn has decided to hit back at the few by punishing and speaking ill of the whole forum. This means you and me!

Thanks for putting an end to this madness Russ, I had a funny feeling about that one. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Sandi
xoxo

Russ,

thanks for the balanced view and creating your own highlighting of Lynn's justified comments. Freedom of speech???